Bandit

I did not know of this term in Golf until I was accused of being one I therefore googled it(good old google).

Bandit

See hustler, shark

HustlerA golfer with greater ability who purposely maintains a higher handicap in order to win more bets and competitions

See Shark

Now I am not entirely happy about being accused of such practice particularly by someone whom I have never met and who knows nothing whatsoever about me. But I would however like to clarify the situation in respect of my present handicap. I am a memebr of a Golf club and on joining I was given a club Handicap after hading in my best three cards, this was set at 24 although was in reality 28 that was 9 months ago, I have never played in a competition nor for money or any other reward, I play with friends for the fun and enjoyment, I have improved over the last 9 months(I stareted about 18 months ago) since joining the golf club, my current hadicap is 21.3 I got this from golfshake.com by inputing my latest scores, which included my round of 84 which has led to the comments. I have absolutely no wish to play golf at an unfair advantage, be it against my mates or otherwise, I hope this clears up the situation, and I welcome any comments in keeping ith the good nature of this site.

You will have to get used to being unhappy every time you get called a bandit, and if you continue in your present vein then this will arise again in the not too distant future.

You are a member of a club yet are not playing in competitions so that your handicap reflects your actual form.

Inputting friendly games into Golfshake I am afraid does not constitute a legal handicap which would get you entry to any decent club open competition. Friendly golf is entirely diifferent from competition golf.

You are playing golf with an unfair advantage, Sorry but that is a fact.

 

Pat, what actually preceeded you being called a bandit. What hadicap did you declare and what did you shoot. It seems like the 2 gentlemen above are in the know but im afraid i must have missed that post.

Col

Lads give the man e break. Look Pat there right wot there saying, but this season play in the com's and the h'cap will sort itself out.

In the mean time, any body who wants a game of scrach lets bang the money in and tee off. (and no john , no ref's, i trust youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu)

Hi all,

This is quite an intresting "debate" here and one that i have had with some colleagues at work who i play with. I currently play off 21 (i know that my golf shake says 22.8 but ive only put in 4 cards at the moment and in my defence 3 of those rounds were with new irons) but this is by no means an "offical" hadicap as i dont play in comps or medals but only scored when playing "frendly" games, however i would like to state that these are scored correctly and there are no "mulligans or give me's". 

Anyways we played a game last summer and i had all i can say was a dream round, putts were dropping instead of the usuall lip outs, my short game was awesome (if i say so myself) and i making GIR on most holes. I ended up scoring 9 under my then handicap. I was ofcourse beratted for being a bandit, and i would do the same if i had never played someone and they shot a score like that, however luckly i have played with these guys loads of times before and they know my usuall scores so it was done in a jovial way.

Of course the next time i played i was back to my usuall game of wayward drives and leaving putts to short. I have since never shot near that score. So this was my "freak" round. 

What im getting at is that this kinda thing can happen (and does in most sports not only golf). However it is deffenatly the exception. And ofcouse i would be very sceptical/livid if a guy in a comp pitched up and shot 10 under his delared handicap.

So all im saying is i wouldnt call pat a bandit in these curcumstances and im sure that john can apperceate that this kinda thing sometimes (although very rarely) happens!

Cheers.

D

 

I was once called a bandit on this very site myself for not incluidng a score obtained whilst playing a freindly game. I took it light heartedly and even changed my avatar to a sombrero just to show i wasnt bothered.

Now i am slightly confused as i dont play official club matches as i am not affiliated to a course but do play competitive comps as part of a society that i run. I now track all my scores for whatever games, unless there is no sss for the course using my account and i track only my competition scores forthe society using a 2nd account. The 2 are only about 0.2 apart at the moment.

I may not have played 10 shots below my handicap yet but i have certainly recently taken 10 shots of my best round ever at my local course so it is always possible to have great rounds.

Pat, Danny is right IMO that this may be a freak round, lets hope not as i would prefer to be called a bandit than think i have already played by best round ever

 

Lads, CHEAT is not a nice word. but in golf. PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE'S

Pat, golf is a game of fun, where we all have a    and   about. Just enjoy your golf, and be honest with your self, at the end of the day it's you aganst the course.

BEST GAME IN THE WORLD................

Great round Pat, an 84 is good scoring in most peoples books,I recently had an 83 off 20 h.c. same as Colin fairways, greens, birdies and the hole just seemed bigger that day but I think posting that score on here was only ever going to get one reaction, you bandit....

This is the post that Pat found offensive.

An 84 off 24 tells me you are a bandit. (I should have put 22) but that is still 10 under his handicap.

Just telling it the way it is. It is not my fault if he did not even know what a bandit in golf was.

Crawling round him will not help him one little bit.

I would like to point out that the word I used was a common golfing term and nowhere did I call him a cheat. That would only a arise if he did that to me in a match.

I am not arguing with you, David, when I called him a bandit it was based on what he posted in the thread. He took umbrage at me saying that and went into one, which as you know, I will not let go.

If he can shoot 84 then his handicap should not be 22, that is all I am saying.

You are a better player than he is so I expect that you are able, on occasion, to be a bandit also.

Who knows, perhaps you are saving it up for next week.

Anthony, i can assure you it had neither an SSS nor windmills. It was the par three 9 hole at Bunsay Downs which i have entered but i had to make up the SSS. Shot 4 over par the back 9 which i was extremely happy with.

 

Col

Pat,

I would not be too bothered at being called "bandit". Generally speaking anybody who shoots under thier handicap would probably hear the term around their ear holes particularly if the banditry results in a competition win...

It is more a term said in jest and I can assure you John was not implying that you cheated...

Good on you for shooting that score...I shot 88 on friday in winds - off 19 which was a good day for me. but I guess on this occasion I was a bandit...

NWOT............

I think you've cracked it Pat.

You could borrow Wayne's

Well done Pat - I think thats a great score regardless of everything. The main thing is it shows you can play really well and shoot low scores - repeating it is the hardest part - thats whythis game is so brill........

 

Pat should we just call you Dick then ?!?!?  lol sorry dude that was just too easy !!  lol

Nice avatar Pat thats the spirit

Perhaps ill dig out the old sombrero

 

Dick Turpin, there is no explanation you can come up with that will satisfy me in respect of shooting 12 under your club handicap and not be expected to be called a bandit.

I have experienced this phenomena for over fifty years, you are lucky that you had never heard of the word.

Just accept that we are not on the same wavelength and leave it at that.

Pat, you alright with me, you must be a northern boy.

John, give the lad some slack.

Graham, I don't have a problem with Pat, it is he who has a problem with me.

 

John, not wishing to take sides on this debate but could you please clarify one of your earlier remarks.

I have previoulsy been hailed as a bandit for shooting an 83 during a freindly but not including it in my handicap calcs (it is there now if anybody wants to check) but you say that non competition games shouldnt be included in handicap calcs.

(1) IYO am i a bandit in the above scenario i shot 40 points which was 4 under my handicap at the time. Not for the score but for not including it in my calcs

(2) If you confirm that non comp rounds should not be used for handicao calcs where do you stand if someone takes time out of comps to practice their game and come back much better than they previously were. What if they had a suite of lessons which resolved some fundemental flaw in their game for example. How does someone correct their handicap before a comp without playing comps? if you get my drift

(3) Just for fun what should i called on the many times that i shoot 10 or more over my handicap

 

I am not up on the latest rules regarding handicaps, but I have always thought that only competition rounds played off the back tees can count towards handicaps. I play two competition rounds a week at my club and, quite frankly the course is too long in the winter for me to have a real impact.

In all the clubs I have been a member of over fifty years people who do not put cards in during the year, have their handicap lapsed and they are not eligible to play in any competition until they have submitted a further three cards.

At the time Pat shot that marvelous 84 his current club handicap was 24, no matter which way you want to look at it, that is a round of a bandit. Nothing to debate about it at all.

If I shot ten over my handicap then I would probably shoot myself.

A handicap is supposed to be what you would normally shoot under summer conditions, or it used to be till they brought in handicaps over 24.

You know my position on this now, Colin and I do not have a problem whichever side of the fence you want to sit on.

I will look forward to meeting you at Donnington and sharing ideas and beers.

 

John, i've no problem with you.

I will look forward to meeting you at N V S du' and sharing a beer or 2.

These forums are a good place for all of us to chat, learn, and most of all have a

. We have gone over most topics on the game we all love, Pat,keep playin' i'm sure everybody will be keepin' an eye on your scores.

Ok John, wasnt trying to get a rise just fueling the debate which i think is an intersting one.

In some sort of parody of an official club handicap i now have one which i track all my scores (see left) as per Chris above but i keep a second for society competition games only. Its the best i can hope to achieve without actually joining a club.

For anyone interested my all rounds handicap will be coming out to play on the north vs south so i will not be taking any advantage on the day. Does everybody else competing track all their scores or just the comps?

39 points does not make you a bandit, Anthony, I feel that 40 and over is what gets up peoples noses.

Decimilisation of the handicap system is what made it a joke IMO.

Pat, it would be easier to ask who has not been called a bandit .I suspect there wont be many (on here or anywhere) it goes with the game.Most times it is meant in jest and sometimes just to play with your opponents head. The word Bandit in golf refers to people who can do a bit of damage off their hcp occasionally , not cheats. If you regularly shoot in the 80's and I suspect you don't then you would need to address your hcp,and remember were all responsible for ones own Hcp's.

Colin, you can call your friendly round a competition if you play it under competition rules and off the back markers, with every putt holed out, unfortunately, these days, there are too many clubs with winter tees and greens that the whole system becomes a mockery. I am fortunate where I play that we do not suffer these conditions.

There are eight holes on each of the two courses at my club that I cannot reach in regulation figures under winter conditions and the prevailing wind, so you can imagine that my iron play and short game has to be pretty good to play to the handicap I currently have.

I dont play off back tees John, only have twice before on Secret valley and Aphrodite hills in Cyprus. Scored a 98 on secret valley we'll not talk about Aprodite hills, damn thats a tough course

One thing i never do is not hole out, ive paid for that shot so im damn well gonna take it. Gets up my nose when people pick up when playing strokeplay. Its not in the hole till its in the hole

 

I have played both those and Tsada as well. Aphrodite Hills is an excellent course, I thought the other two were quite tatty when I played them a few years ago.  Nice Island with some wonderful restaurants.

Secret valley was by far my favourite but im sure i would have liked aphrodite alot more if id shot 98 of the back. Dont suppose you cleared the valley on the long par 5?

All the par fives were long to me.

this one John

Hi Ned.

No one's ever called me a bandit. I find it quite upsetting really, but speaks volumes about my ability.

No crusade on my part, Pat, but you certainly have your knickers in a twist. My initial post was only based on your words. It is not my fault that you lied in that post, which David Marshall pointed out to you.

It is very hard to base anything on fact if the facts offered are lies.

Now I suggest you get your act together and only deal in true facts. Did you or did you not shoot 84 on a Par 72? Simple question. If you did, then you are a bandit,end of.

I may be behind my keyboard, Pat but that does not mean I would not be prepared to say what I have said to your face.  I never called you a cheat, I called you a bandit, which at the time you did not know what a bandit was, what else don't you know.

This is your problem Pat, you cannot see that you lied when you posted that great round of 84 by saying it was a Par 72 as opposed to a Par 67, information from David Marshall.

If it were indeed a Par 72 then what I said in the first place is correct, as your current cluib handicap, which would be accepted anywhere is 24, now my mathematics tells me that means you shot 12 under your handicap. Now with the best will in the world I am afraid that is what we call in the game, being a bandit.

I have just read further down your post and now find that you have admitted that you did make an error, by three strokes in fact, Par was 69. You will have to accept that even then, the amount you were under is too great a margin to be called luck, especially as I find that winter conditions on the greens and in your case with winter tees, that scoring is usually more difficult. The mere fact that you haven't tells me that you do have an aptitude for the game and are improving rapidly.

I don't know what dictionary you use but if someone writes something that is not true it is false and a falsehood can only be called a lie.

The only name I have called you is a bandit, which is a well known expression in golf. Please point me to any instances where I have called you anything else, if anything it is you who is being derogatory in attempting to wriggle out of the hole that you have dug yourself.

Perhaps as you got the Par wrong, it is possible that the 84 is not even correct, not that I am remotely interested.

Good Luck to you also Pat, hope your game goes from strength to strength.

I can no longer stand and most certainly cannot deliver.

Good morning, David, Thanks for your endeavours, but the last three stableford points would most certainly bring on the "Bandit" tag. Four pars and two birdies are something that 24 handicappers just do not do.

WHAT I CAN SEE WITH THE SCORE CARDS, PAT HAS PUT HIS SCORES IN AND GOT THE H'CAP FOR THEM SCORES. I MUST ADMIT PAT THEY ARE GOOD SCORES FOR A 24 H'CAP, BUT IT SEEMS TO ME THAT'S WHAT THE SYSTEM HAS GIVEN YOU!

N v S social?  Up to a point Wayne, up to a point.

The results of our mid-week stableford has turned up another Bandit.

http://www.sherfieldoaksgolf.co.uk/user/default.asp?JumpTo=

You are becoming a bore, Pat, you made a post that was a lie and now you are trying to wriggle. The truth hurts doesn't it.

 

I am not judging your character at all, Pat, it is you who made the original statement which was later admitted by you to be false, that alone makes the original post a lie.

Secondlly, I never called you a cheat, I called you a bandit and thirdly I am going to reiterate, you are becoming a bore.

You will find that I am very tenacious and I will not let go until you stop posting to me or about me. I will always respond.

Just for your information seeing as you are not too aware of what goes on in this golf game, that if you had put in the 84 as a card for handicap then you would be the proud owner of a handicap of 17 as even though you put in three cards normally the lowest is what you are assessed on.

I thought Bandit was just an affectionate term for a.n.other golfer who scored well over 36 points on stableford on a society day, thus taking home the spoils...

 

A friend of mine plays the same par 64 course week in week out, shooting about 7 over par regularly...wanted to play for money but said he was an 18 handicap, and his excuse was that if he played another course he would be nowhere near as good, as he knew his regular course so well...Now THAT is a Bandit!!!

You cannot be serious, Dave, it is not my fault that Pat had never heard of the expression "Bandit" and then proceeded to look the definition up in a dictionary, after which he decided to attempt to upset me. That will never work with me, as I am too long in the tooth. I only apologise when I am in the wrong.

Now to your wonderful round where you scored five pars and one birdie, do you realise that bogey golf for the rest of the round would have meant you had played sixteen shots under your handicap, even if you double bogeyed every other hole then you would still have played five under your handicap, so perhaps yours is false as well.

So I repeat:

"Four pars and two birdies are something that 24 handicappers just do not do."

and for good measure:

"Five pars and one birdie is also something that 27 handicappers just do not do."

So, yes Dave, I do feel you are mising the point.

You started it, Pat, but unfortunately for you, lacked the ammunition to make a direct hit.

Pathetic, Pat, you tried to be brave, lost out, now your crying. Be a man.

David, did you read my post? where I explained everything, or are you just attempting to have a little stir.

I stand by what I said, and I suggest you go back, read again, and inwardly digest , then perhaps you will realise, that what I have said is correct.

Your golfshake handicap is only as good as the cards that you submit and by admitting that you are quite capable of far better golf than your current handicap, would suggest that I was right in the first place.

 

 

  

 

 

 

Danny James if you cannot say anything constructive to the debate, may I suggest you shut up.

Dave, I assume from where you play your golf that all the rounds you submit are just friendly games which have not been played under competition rules, that club members, like myself have to strictly adhere to.

I only play competitive golf, always have.

Just remember that with the handicap system that Golfshake generously supplies it is open to all kinds of manipulation, especially when the first handicap is allocated.

You will also realise that under the current system it requires a lot of rounds one way or the other to  either go up or down significantly.

Now back to the first item, five pars and one birdie is something that I don't ever do off my handicap of fourteen, if I were to, I would not be fourteen.

This all started with a post from Pat which I have highlighted:

From my own experience which is fairly limited(around 18 months) I have found I have reached a level in golf that most golfers on my Local course are at(not very good by the way) my best so far is 84 on a par 72 playing off 22, but looking round on most of my outings the people around me are hitting similair bad shots, keep at it Alan and forget the snobbery it will soon pale into insignificance as your game starts to improve

I read this post  and immediately thought to myself that 10 under ones handicap is what we call being a bandit, so I responded with:

An 84 off 24 tells me you are a bandit.

(The reason I said 24 was because he had said that was his allocated handicap at his club) he later said it was 22 and then David Marshall pointed ot that the standard scratch was 67, so some mistruths there.

There is nothing malicious about that remark at all and if you are a golfer, you will know that. Unfortunately Pat took it in the wrong spirit as he was not even aware of the term after having played the game for 18months, I ask you, can you believe that.

I have nothing to apologise for and will not be doing so to anyone who I feel has attempted to stir things up unnecessarily.

I thought this subject had been dropped, but it seems that there are some who wish to carry on a vendetta, well let me tell any of you, I do not crack under pressure, threats, or intimidation, so every response will be responded to and I suggest that if you are fed up, then stop.

I will also say that I do not hold grudges and always respond in kind.

Danny James, you really should learn when to shut up, as you have contributed nothing to this thread and would appear that you are unable to.

i think the thing to realise is that anyone can have a good or bad day on the course - even high handicappers can shoot well on good days (ive played against a few) and also seen some low handicappers play bad, i'd say the term bandit would be better suited to someone that consistently plays off a higher handicap knowing that they are gaining an unfair advantage doing so.....does that make sense ??!?!

 

 

What you say, Alps, is probably what everyone would agree with, myself included, but it is not my fault if someone takes umbrage at the word "Bandit" when he obviously never knew its meaning and in what context it is commonly used in the world of golf.

We must not get confused with those players who deliberately maintain a high handicap and then go pot hunting in competitions both home and abroad. They do the game no good whatsoever, but we have all come across them at some time or other.

Enjoy your holiday.

 

True say about those not maintaining handicap John, but at the end of the day they are only doing themselves out i guess, especially when they play in comps where yoiu have to play off 3/4 off your handicap...lol

David ....dont hold back with the words hahahahah..

Lets all remember tio have fun now !!!

Your first paragraph, J P is what I have always accepted as being correct. In fact most medal rounds were won with scores much nearer par than below it.

I agree that very high handicappers have every chance of improving their score by a substantial amount on occasion, like last weeks roll up was won with 44 points but his handicaps was 36, which means he has played to 28. I don't have a problem with that, it is the 24 handicapper who shoots low numbers that I find difficult to believe.

Your 76 at Woburn ( A fine round I might say having played the course myself) is easily justified off your handicap of ten as to be that handicap you can obviously strike the ball with accuracy.

The term "Bandit" in actual fact is almost an endearing compliment which the majority of players will understand, those like you mentioned in your paragraph 6 have always been with us, I'm afraid and there is not a lot we can do about it.

Since decimalisation of the handicap system the game has gone to pot IMO and allowing handicaps higher than 24 just should not be allowed, as it certainly makes the playing field uneven and has lowered the overall standard of play we are now witnessing.

This always used to be the case, J P, this meant that with the threequarters handicap allowed in matchplay that no one would ever receive more than 18 shots, one a hole. Getting two shots on a hole is taking the p**s.

Stableford comps used to be 7/8ths and only in Medal did one receive full handicap allowance.

I sometimes get drawn with one of our younger members in the roll-up and he has the power to be very near the green in two shots on our first par five, a hole I can barely reach in three, yet he is virtually playing a par five hole of 30 yds when compared to 500+ yds for me. It is ridiculous.

hey Pat,

how did i miss this thread!!

at the end of the day, everyone can have a great round in their early golfing life. i have witnessed it myself with a mate. i was playing off 16 and went round in 76. he was off 28 and went round in 79. i was VERY dubious as to if he counted all shots, used the leather wedge blah blah, but his next game was also fantastic. he was cut BIG time and he is now having problems getting below 100.

IT CAN HAPPEN

so may things can happen on the course and even playing off 16 i can have shockers. but the door swings both ways, even in the pro game. Thomas Levet for example. won an event 2 yrs ago. then may as well have 14 baseball bats in his bag. then wins another event.

i use the term bandit in a very light hearted way. i regularly play with a lot of guys off 20 ish. if they hit a good shot. they hear "bandit!" .

Pat it sounds like you managed to hit all your good shots in one round. GOOD ON YOU FELLA.

it's what keeps us coming back to this poxy game.

as for the "what seems like hostility" either to or from individuals. i say this.

we are not in it for the money. just the chance to play AND ENJOY!!!!

wasnt me, ive never hit 79 in my life and im struggling to break 110 not 100

 

as long as you know that you have been honest with yourself then thats all that really matters.

 

No Pat, it is not tantamount to cheating at all, I never mentioned the word.

You know why you were called a bandit in my response to your post, but you still cannot let go, admit you were wrong and move on.

Before posting it is better to check your facts as they have a habit of bouncing back on you.

 Thank you, Pat, humour is the name of the game.

I play off 18 and shot 87 last week on a par 72 if that helps....

 That's 3 under net - so maybe I am just a "ban" at the minute but hopefully the "dit" will be earned this weekend at our Society comp.

Bandit - aint it just a fun term used for the comp winner or a good knock scorer and not really associated with the term "cheat"..

We always have a bandit crack at our society comps thus, were's ya sombrero or how was your mexican fligh etc etc - always given and taken in the spirit intended.

So if ya have just been called a bandit -well done keep the good rounds going.

Somebody deliberately inflating thier handicaps for financial gain at comps would not be a bandit - the term we use is "devious tt" and for some unknown reason we don't see them again...

If me and my playing partner win at the great N v S event then it was well deserved victory but if we lose then it's a case of - bldy bandits...

Sorry to waffle but I am bored stiff at work waiting for the jobs to come in..

NWOT....

Mr Knatt, you are obviously attempting to stir things up a little more than what they have been already and I am not going to get into an argument with you.

May I suggest you only respond to posts from me that personally affect you in any way, getting involved in others problems are really no concern of yours, and of no interest to me. Before I go I will explain something to you. If a person shoots 12 over par he is not a 22 handicapper, no matter what he says, he is a 12 handicapper, as handicaps are supposed to reflect ones best round under summer conditions not what you might shoot on a bad day.

You appear to be another one who has played for a short time and thinks they know it all, when I can assure you that you don't.

Run along now and enjoy your golf.

J P, it seems that everyone wants a piece of this action and I am surprised that you do.

Still it takes all sorts, I suppose. First of all my original commnt was based on the information that Pat offered, up, not on what someone else discovered halfway through the thread. If you care to look at his current handicap, you will see that he did not get cut by four shots as you say he should. He also stated that he had joined a club and his handicap was 24.

I don't agree with the current handicap situation, never have and never will, as it does not ensure that everyone crosses the line together, and after all that is what a handicap is supposed to achieve.

We should all be handicapped to the best of our ability.

Now to the scratch man, you may not know this,but to attain scratch means that you have to spend a lot of time shooting below par, as it is normal for the SSS at most courses to be below par, or scratch will never be maintained, either under the old system or the new.

Five shots under ones handicap is most certainly bandit territory as far as I am concerned as that equates to 41 points in stableford.

I could just imagine you taking this as lightly as you appear to be doing if the person in question shot an 82 against you off your current handicap. I think you would be a little upset.

22 handicappers are not even supposed to make a par and if they are capable of doing that then they are not 22, simple as that. They all hit it three hundred yds on this forum yet play off high handicaps.

David, let us put this debate into some kind of perspective. an 82 gross off 22 handicap is a nett 60 and I am quite sure that you would agree with me and say that was a score that merit being called a bandit. Not in 55 years of playing have I ever produced such a score, yet it seems that it is accepted by all and sundry these days as normal. You would have to shoot a 73 just to halve with him and when was the last time you did that kind of score? and where is J P going to find the 70 gross to also halve with him.

SSS is only comes into effect when handicaps are being adjusted, Medal rounds are played off full handicap, stableford should be off 7/8ths but is more often than not full handicap and matchplay should be 3/4 difference between handicap but is now nearly always full hadicap allowance. The whole game is being made easy for the high handicapper all the time.

11 of us played Cams Hall yesterday and with a fiver each in the pot it is worth winning and it was won with 36 points and the worst score in was a 32.

David,perhaps next month you would like to join me as a guest of mine at my club, when hopefully it will be warmer, usually is in May,

Pat,  I will never be under pressure from a genuine 22 handicapper it is those who shoot ten under it when masquerading as a 22 handicapper that I might have a problem with.

Of course my game is waning, I would be the first to agree, but that does not stop me attempting to get it back amnd tryuing to get my handicap lower.

I have no objection to anyone disagreeing with me at all, but I will not stand idly by when I am being fed a what IMO I consider bulls**t.

If you are going to respond to anything I say then it is common courtesy to address the post to me, not put in some snide remark to another poster thinking or hoping that it will go unnoticed.

I have given the opportunity for this thread to ease its way into oblivion, but it seems there are some on here who wish it to carry on, and as long as there are posts that refer to me then they can expect an answer.

Just remember Pat, the game is played against par all the time, only handicaps are adjusted according to the SSS. Pros only play against par.

So I will congratulate you on a fine nett 60 which is something I have never done in my life.

Come now John -

 You must of congratulated someone at some time during your life...

 Or did you mean shooting net 60....

NWOT.....

Pat, an opinion to which you are entitled but not one that I agree with.

Robbie, I have spent a lifetime congratulating opponents who have got the better of me. I am not a bad loser at all, but  handicap competitions do seem to pop up the odd player who seems to play well below their abilities.

Who knows, you may get lucky and draw me next week in the match.

That would be good...

On the h/c system for the comp you would be off scratch and me off 3 ish -

Is that right...? - put me down for a nil all draw....

NWOT......

As you said yourself, David, you were called a bandit after doing that score, but don't forget that at the standard you were you had the ability, I just don't believe that a genuine high handicapper has that ability, if he has, then he is lower than what he states he is.

Golfshake events are not a good way to judge really as the courses chosen are usually new to everyone so a good score is always hard to come by, even for the excellent strikers, like Kevin, Stuart, Davi Ley and your goodself.

OK for May, then I will be delighted to have you as my guest for the day. Glad you will be able to make it.

J P, I am in total agreement with your last post.

Danny, only you will know whether or not your handicap is relative to your game.

I don't know about anyone elses views but I am always trying to reduce mine. Don't forget that bad rounds do not make a serious dent in your handicap, so the good rounds should more than compensate.

Danny,

Like you, I can have a good day (87 score), and average day (92 score) and an above average day (98 score) and I input all my rounds. This has got me to 18.2.

I know I am no better than an 18 handicapper really even with the occasional 87 because the norm is more likely to be 92.

However, handicaps (I believe) are a measure of your potential rather than what you are achieving and therefore maybe I am potentially 16 h/c - who knows or even who cares...

Personally I think the h/c system needs a complete revamp - I have never understood why somebody who trains hard, gets professional coaching,plays regular and becomes half decent is then penalised because of his/her ability..

Everybody off scratch and if golfers can't play well ,then its a case of train and practice harder..

I mean come on, Boro would not give Cardiff a two goal start just because Boro are premier status now would they....

Mmmmmmmmm. Probably not the best example (but any Cardiff fans here will be rolling)...

NWOT....

I think, like a lot of you have said on here - high handicappers are very inconsitent! I went travelling around Europe for the whole of last summer and didnt get any golf in, as a result my game has gone dramitically downhill, I still submit all my scorecards, no matter how embarrassing they are!

No bandit rounds so far, but now that im playing regularly again im hoping to see some improvement in my scores again, back down to what I think I should be playing off!

Im sure in this process of improvement i will have a round much lower than my handicap and so be called a bandit, lets just hope it happens at the North v South, so that us southerners get that trophy back!

The trophy back Luke?!?.. The southerners have never won it yet. I'm stuck in the Middle East at the minute working but am so looking forward to coming back for the NvS. Roll on the 13th

PS This is defo the best forum thread yet, keep it going fellas.

Can I just clarify 1 point to avoid any confusion and people crying foul

J P, quoted the following on Weds 2nd Apr at 14:59

As it is stands, if a 22 handicaper (buffer zone 4) shoots 12 over par he will be cut 4 shots (0.4 x 10) thus he or she would be off 18 the next time they play.

Technically you woulld get dropped 0.4 for 4 shots which would take you to 20.4, you would then enter Category 3 and would have reductions of 0.3 for the remaining 6 shots. So the handicap would be 18.6 with a playing handicap o f19 next time they play.

Regards, Darren.

Your right, Anthony, golf is not great at the moment, but I will persevere, regarding the trophy, everyone is entiitled to their little bit of fame. Better to be a has been than a never wasser.